The 'Sin Sod' (pay your wife's family upon marriage)

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ReubenA
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The 'Sin Sod' (pay your wife's family upon marriage)

Post by ReubenA »

I've heard a lot about this but don't know much in detail. For those who don't know it's basically the money you pay to your Thai wife's family upon getting married. What do you guys think of it?

Has anyone been through the process and knows how it works? I've heard sometimes you get the money back, sometimes not, depending on how traditional the family is.
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PatrickK
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Re: The 'Sin Sod' (pay your wife's family upon marriage)

Post by PatrickK »

Good topic to discuss. I think it is supposed to show the woman's family that the man has the resource to take care of the woman. From a foreign perspective, it is very odd.

A few questions:
1) Why does money, an external thing, have to be a part of love (which is internal)? I've always disliked that, and this sin sod falls right into that.
2) Why do men give money but women don't? I know men are supposed to be the ones to take care of the women, but is that right? In the west people talk about how women don't have the high roles and positions that men have, but things like this create those effects. It almost puts women at a lower social class, and it is accepted.

I knew a Thai guy who had to take out a sizeable loan to pay the sin sod, and it put him into debt for 10+ years. Anyone know if this is common?
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aire_patta
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Re: The 'Sin Sod' (pay your wife's family upon marriage)

Post by aire_patta »

สินสอด , its tradition for the groom to show that he will be able to look after his bride once they are married .Most the time the bride's family will return the money to the couple anyway.

How it works imo Thai law is not very protective of the females. It is widely believed that if in some circumstances, where the couple get divorced, the wife will have enough money to support her kids.
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PatrickK
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Re: The 'Sin Sod' (pay your wife's family upon marriage)

Post by PatrickK »

aire_patta wrote:สินสอด , its tradition for the groom to show that he will be able to look after his bride once they are married .Most the time the bride's family will return the money to the couple anyway.
Interesting. I have more questions:
How do they determine whether it is returned or not? Is it frowned upon if it isn't returned? How long after the marriage do they return it?
How it works imo Thai law is not very protective of the females. It is widely believed that if in some circumstances, where the couple get divorced, the wife will have enough money to support her kids.
Where does the woman get the money from? The สินสอด?
farang84
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Re: The 'Sin Sod' (pay your wife's family upon marriage)

Post by farang84 »

It's to ensure that in the event of a divorce, the woman won't be left with nothing. Then again, I don't know the legal system all that well. Are wives entitled to half upon divorce? If there is no such entitlement, the sin sod provides that emergency stability. Like aire said, many families will pay you back - or even put the money up themselves and just use it for display at the wedding for the guests.

Thai women who have no qualms about you paying however many hundreds of thousands in sin sod or don't think twice about asking for you to send money to their parents are the kind to stay away from.
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Tod Daniels
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Re: The 'Sin Sod' (pay your wife's family upon marriage)

Post by Tod Daniels »

The topic of สินสอด has been beaten to death on every thai related forum out on the inter-web since foreign guyz have been marryin' thai women.. :lol:

First OFF, according to the mythical beast known as "thai culture"; a bride to be would NEVER, as in NEVER EVER bring up the topic of สินสอด to her husband to be, nor would her family either. That goes 100% against thai cultural rules of the process (except it appears where foreigners are concerned). :o

These negotiations are almost 100% of the time done by a third party (village head man, some one respected by both families). They are often protracted negotiations, with guarantees of how much is shown on the table, how much is in cash, how much is in gold, and how much IF ANY is to be kept by the family or the bride. So if your 'thai bride to be' tells you what her parents expect for สินสอด, it should raise a GIANT red flag! :shock:

Secondly, in the 10+ years I've been here I've never seen a thai male pay a single baht in สินสอด if he's marrying a thai woman who
A) has kidz by a previous b/f, husband
or
B) has been married or lived with a thai guy before (even if there's no kidz)..
It just doesn't happen, or let me say I've never seen it happen and I know many many adult thai guyz who've married thai women! While this may sound harsh, in thai society the term is actually; มือสอง (second hand), and there's no สินสอด paid in marriages like that. :roll:

Because thai society is so regimented and stratified (where people born poor stay poor, and rich people stay rich) there is very little "out of class" marrying. In fact there are two thai idioms which show this quite well. One is called an "angel with a temple dog" นางฟ้ากับหมาวัด and means a rich gurl which married a poor guy.. The other is a "mouse that fell into a tank of raw rice" หนูตกถังข้าวสาร and means a poor gurl who married a rich guy. To put it another way, most thaiz marry within the socio-economic class they're born into, end of story.

Now it is true สินสอด can run into the millions of baht if both families are wealthy, both have considerable sway in the communities, etc. It's also true that it can be nothing as in not a single baht! Especially up country!

I have been to more than my share of those "dog-and-pony-show" thai wedding parties (which BTW: doesn't mean you're really married in the eyes of the law, it's just a "gain face" thing for the family). Most of the thai/thai ones I've been to the สินสอด (or a great portion of it) was returned to the groom or groom's family right after the ceremony! The gold, the money etc, was laid out on the table for one purpose; for SHOW! :)

It was not for the benefit of the thai woman's family :roll: and not to protect the woman should the marriage go sideways :? , it was for gaining "face" in the community. :D

However, on the other side of the coin, in nearly every foreign/thai wedding I've been to, the สินสอด was NOT returned to the groom after the ceremony :x AND it was the groom who usually ponied up the money for the marathon drinking feasting wedding party as well! :(

Unfortunately most foreigners have a very skewed idea of "thai culture". This is due to the fact that
A) most foreigners can't speak/understand thai
and
B) what they know about 'thai culture' has been spoon-fed to them by their thai significant other..

I'm just wanting to tell you, don't believe everything you hear or read about.. It's mostly just smoke and mirrors! ;)

Note 2 MODZ; if this post is too close to or over the line, please feel free to delete it.. :)
Whoever said 'Money can't buy you love or joy' obviously was not making enough money. <- Quote by Gene $immon$ of the rock group KISS
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