is there a better way to learn the 3 class
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
I suspect you were able to use grammar properly before you could parse a sentence and explain the grammatical functions and parts of speech of every word in that sentence. I don't see why that would be impossible to do with learning to pronounce Thai. Have a lot of exposure and patters become a part of you.. Again, my issue is not with learning the classes, but rather with the notion that is is the "only" way to be able to pronounce Thai properly - or even the "only" way to read a new word on sight correctly.
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
Yes, you're right
Thai people could likely speak Thai with perfect tones by the time they get to about 10 years old, even if they didn't learn the consonant classes (Although they do learn the classes).
So I guess 10 years of experience of speaking Thai would likely be a good alternative to spending 2-3 hours learning the consonant classes.
Thai people could likely speak Thai with perfect tones by the time they get to about 10 years old, even if they didn't learn the consonant classes (Although they do learn the classes).
So I guess 10 years of experience of speaking Thai would likely be a good alternative to spending 2-3 hours learning the consonant classes.
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
I doubt it takes 10 years...but on that note, I read somewhere that the English rhotic "r" takes native speakers 7 years to fully master from the time of birth. However, it doesn't take an adult learner of English so long to learn it. One advantage adults have over infants and children is the ability to recognize patterns at a much faster rate. Let's assume there are 100 words that are new to both you and a Thai child of about 7 years old. I am sure you could learn those 100 words faster than the child, despite the child being the native speaker.
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
If you were learning Thai, and you noticed a "pattern" that ขสศษหฉฐถผฝ, when followed by a long vowel, with no final consonant, all had a rising tone. Would you consider this a "Pattern" or a "Rule"? or that it doesn't really matter because it all amounts to exactly the same thing?
Regardless on whether you actively learn the rules, or whether you passively learn them by "recognising patterns", it all amounts to the same thing.
Regardless on whether you actively learn the rules, or whether you passively learn them by "recognising patterns", it all amounts to the same thing.
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
So, then, would you say that book study of rules is not necessary and that exposure is enough?
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
Of course exposure allows you to learn a language. It's the natural method of learning.
But in comparison to learning via exposure + tuition (e.g. rules etc), people will generally learn at a much slower rate and are more susceptible to learning bad habits, as learning purely via exposure limits the amount of exposure to the language which someone has.
E.g. If a Thai native speaker was an orphan, so his parents couldn't teach him any of the language rules. And then instead of going to school, he became a begger on the street, so that he only learnt Thai via exposure. If the only formal exposure he had to Thai writing was watching Gor Eei Gor Gai on TV (Because all kids love that song! lol). Everything else was just working out for himself what billboards meant etc.
What do you think his Thai would like, compared to a Thai person who learned Thai at school, at say 10? 20? 30? 40?
But in comparison to learning via exposure + tuition (e.g. rules etc), people will generally learn at a much slower rate and are more susceptible to learning bad habits, as learning purely via exposure limits the amount of exposure to the language which someone has.
E.g. If a Thai native speaker was an orphan, so his parents couldn't teach him any of the language rules. And then instead of going to school, he became a begger on the street, so that he only learnt Thai via exposure. If the only formal exposure he had to Thai writing was watching Gor Eei Gor Gai on TV (Because all kids love that song! lol). Everything else was just working out for himself what billboards meant etc.
What do you think his Thai would like, compared to a Thai person who learned Thai at school, at say 10? 20? 30? 40?
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
Well, now it seems we are leaving tone rules specifically and going into language use in general. I have no doubt that a well-educated Thai has a far higher level of Thai than someone who isn't educated. Then again, perhaps the uneducated one enjoys reading a lot (and not just comics!) I'm not sure about learning at a slower rate, but I would say recognizing mistakes would be at a much slower rate without tuition.
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
Going back to the OP's question:
If you learn to write the alphabet in this order, then you only have to remember 3 things:
Left column - mid class
Middle column - high class
Right 2 columns - low class
It's as easy as that
If you learn to write the alphabet in this order, then you only have to remember 3 things:
Left column - mid class
Middle column - high class
Right 2 columns - low class
It's as easy as that
Re: is there a better way to learn the 3 class
In my opinion as a native Thai speaker and a Thai language teacher;
1. most native Thais are also confused with the consonant classes
2. the classes don’t indicate the tones of the consonant letters
3. the classes don’t indicate the type or characteristics of sounds
Therefore, I think outside the box and teach my students to group the consonants and other letters (vowels, etc.) according to their sounds and characteristics such as hard sounds, soft sounds, nasal sounds, short sounds, long sounds etc.
Think of the sounds rather than the names. Then learn how the sounds interact with each other and how the tone changes when different sounds are combined and how the tone changes when we add the tone mark.
Basically, the scripts represent the sounds and the written grammar has rules like mathematic formulas for the sounds we make.
If was to explain in detail it would take hours so I hope my consonants video can help you to get off the best start.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... lfun1nQuKE_
1. most native Thais are also confused with the consonant classes
2. the classes don’t indicate the tones of the consonant letters
3. the classes don’t indicate the type or characteristics of sounds
Therefore, I think outside the box and teach my students to group the consonants and other letters (vowels, etc.) according to their sounds and characteristics such as hard sounds, soft sounds, nasal sounds, short sounds, long sounds etc.
Think of the sounds rather than the names. Then learn how the sounds interact with each other and how the tone changes when different sounds are combined and how the tone changes when we add the tone mark.
Basically, the scripts represent the sounds and the written grammar has rules like mathematic formulas for the sounds we make.
If was to explain in detail it would take hours so I hope my consonants video can help you to get off the best start.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... lfun1nQuKE_